PP 280: Going for the Truth with Dr. Brian Boxer Wachler

Dr. Brian Boxer Wachler, considered “America’s TV Eye Doctor”, is a leading expert on human perception and vision.

He is one of the world’s leading Keratoconus treatment authorities. He is considered by many “The Keratoconus Guru”. He was the first in the United States to report the results of Intacs for Keratoconus in 1999. For over 18 years, he has performed many thousands of Keratoconus procedures on patients from all over the world. He is the inventor of non-invasive crosslinking called Holcomb C3-R and has performed many thousands of these vision-saving treatments since 2003.

Dr. Brian is known for performing eye surgery on TV, including live surgery in front of millions of viewers on NBC’s Today Show. He is a regular on local and national TV shows and news programs. He is often interviewed by newspapers and magazines for his expert opinion on medical topics. Dr. Brian is a columnist for the Huffington Post.

Dr. Brian has published hundreds of articles and book chapters. He is considered by the media as “America’s Eye Doctor” and is routinely interviewed for his expertise. Further information at www.FixesYourKeratoconus.com.

Dr. Brian received the 2010 Jules Stein Living Tribute Award for inventing C3-R and performing it on U.S. Olympic Bobsled Driver Steve Holcomb that helped restore his vision from Keratoconus, thus enabling him to win the Gold Medal at the 2010 Winter Olympics in Vancouver – this was the first Gold Medal for the United States in bobsled in 62 years. “Holcomb C3-R” was renamed in Steve’s honor on The Doctors television show in 2010 because of the worldwide recognition that Steve brought to the procedure.

Dr. Brian received his medical degree from Dartmouth Medical School and his undergraduate degree from UCLA. He, his wife, and twin daughters reside in Los Angeles.

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Kim Sutton Welcome back to another episode of positive productivity. I’m so happy that you’re here to join me today. And I’m thrilled to introduce our guest, Dr. Brian Boxer Wachler. I got that right, right?

Brian Boxer Wachler You did.

Kim Sutton Okay. Listeners, you know I have trouble with names sometimes. Dr. Brian is the author of Perceptual Intelligence: The Brain’s Secret to Seeing Past Illusion, Misperception, and Self-Deception. Wow. Brian, I have an issue. I speak typos. I already told you that when we were in our pre chat, but that was a tongue twister for me. Wow.

Brian Boxer Wachler And you made it. You made it.

Kim Sutton I made it. I didn’t contribute to the blooper reel in the first five seconds. That’s a score for today. Anyway, I would love if you would jump in and introduce yourself better than I have just done to the listeners.

Brian Boxer Wachler So I am an ophthalmologist, eye surgeon. And I’ve always had an interest in psychology back in Caldwell. Actually, I have to go back even before college. When I was in sixth grade, I secretly checked out from our school’s library. Judy Blume’s classic. Are you There God? It’s me, Margaret. Because I was really curious how the mind of the opposite sex worked. And then in college I was a psychology major and a biology major. Because I wanted to better understand the inner workings of the mind. And then my desire to become a doctor and help people in that way, took me in that road. So I was at the 2014 Winter Olympics, for my patient, Steven Holcomb, who was the US bobsledder and he had an eye disease that I had treated, called Keratoconus, where the cornea is weakened, bulges out. It had really derailed his career back in 2007, when he at that point, had to retire because his vision was so blurry. And it created a lot of problems. He had depression over this and some other issues that he actually details in his book that he had published after But Now I See. And I had developed a procedure to strengthen his cornea called C3R, which I later renamed in his honor, Holcomb C3R because he won the gold medal in bobsled at the Winter Olympics in Vancouver in 2010. Well, then I was there in 2004 years ago at the Sochi Olympics in Russia to support him. And there I saw how Vladimir Putin was manipulating the world’s perceptions compared to what I was really seeing what was happening in Russia. And that’s what made me decide to write the book. And I wanted to help people understand how their perceptions work, and can be accurate or can derail them and cause some problems ranging from serious financial issues, to even health problems, or maybe even life or death situations because of having perceptions that have gone awry. And that’s the reason why I wrote the book was to help people with their decision making.

Kim Sutton What are some of the biggest factors in decision making that you’ve seen?

Brian Boxer Wachler Well, I’ll first give the definition of perceptual intelligence to help answer that, which is how we interpret our experiences to better separate fantasy from reality. Because we all come at this point in life with lots of different biases in terms of how we were raised, how we were parented, religion, culture, social influences around us, and that can affect how we can perceive and does affect how we perceive actually. So understanding in the– first step is to have insight that we all have biases and acknowledge that and be honest with yourself. Because when you are and you have that insight then that allows you to open up and to be able to see what’s real and understand the truth in anything, including what you’re even reading on the internet or news. You know, there’s a lot of “fake news”. How do you sift through that and really understand what’s truthful, because if you’re, you want to operate on good information in your life, and that’s what the book helps people do.

Kim Sutton I cannot remember which guests I was speaking with and I feel so rude for saying that, but I just this week learned the phrase inherited purpose, which goes a bit with this. I mean, we’re not talking about purpose, but there is that inherited perception, you know, we start seeing things as our parents did, or as a society around us does, and we inherit it from them without making our own judgments and decisions. So I can totally see that.

Brian Boxer Wachler Oh, I was just gonna say, going to your point is essentially, we’re all clay, right? When we come into this world. And if you and I happen to have been raised in Saudi Arabia, like our beliefs about a lot of things in life would be really, really different than the way they are now. So that’s just the example of even how you know culture in different countries shapes profoundly how people perceive the world.

Kim Sutton Oh, my gosh, yes. My husband is a US Air Force veteran in one of his deployments. I guess it wasn’t a deployment, but he was in South Korea. So he’s always watching what’s going on in North Korea. And this isn’t necessarily appropriate. I can’t remember his first name, or his name Kim Jong Eun, the Emperor, or the king or whatever he is of North Korea. Folks, I didn’t enjoy social studies so I don’t know the proper title of him. But how his country, his citizens don’t even think that he poops. They think he’s a God, and he’s perfect and–

Brian Boxer WachlerExactly.

Kim Sutton Which amazes me, how can– I can’t imagine just the brainwashing that’s gone on over there.

Brian Boxer Wachler I mean, essentially, it’s like a country wide cult, by and large. The same thing you see with cults with, for example, in United States, how they brainwash people. And there’s a chapter in the book actually about cults exclusively, there’s a whole chapter about that concept. And because, you know, perception and perceptual intelligence applies to everything in life, everything in life. And when you have the situation over there in North Korea, you’re exactly right. You know, they’re brainwashed. It’s like a gigantic cult.

Kim Sutton Absolutely. This is so not, you know, talking about perceptual intelligence, but I almost just want to drop a whole plane load of the children’s book, Everybody Poops into North Korea. I know that’s so not appropriate. I’m sorry. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Well, we were discussing a little bit pre chat the Olympics are starting the day after this episode airs. And I didn’t even know that it’s– I didn’t even know that there’s Olympics this year, because I have for the most part removed myself from watching TV. Yes, we have cable, but only because it gets us a cheaper internet rate. And I tend to stay clear of the news on social media, just because it seems to be so negative lately. And it’s not helping my greater purpose so I steer clear. But one of the items, or one of the topics in your book, is why do we gravitate to products endorsed by celebrities? Is that true, though? Sorry, I have not read it.

Brian Boxer Wachler Yeah.

Kim Sutton Okay. And I can see how, you know, if I can see all the time how when we’re watching TV and mercy in the commercials, one that I can think of right now is Old Spice. You know, those classic Old Spice commercials. See, this is the last time I watch TV, I don’t even know if they’re still on these days with the guy. The the tall, handsome, dark guy is in the shower. And he’s like, this is why you need it, you know, or people flock to it. Personally, I don’t like the smell just being honest. But it took off or.

Brian Boxer Wachler You don’t like the smell Kim because you have hung around a lot of fishing hatcheries for a while, I guess.

Kim Sutton Yeah, no, I absolutely have not. But I mean, when you look at other brands, as well, it seems like every pop star has their own perfume brand, or female pop star right now has their own perfume brand. And people are flocking to it just because it’s either designed by or promoted by the celebrity.

Kim Sutton And it’s a huge problem because celebrities and for that matter, anybody that people look up to, or admire, have what’s called the halo effect, which means that whatever their opinions are, or whatever they state can have a tremendous amount of influence because people admire them, even if there’s talking about something outside of what they’re admired about. I’ll give you an example with a celebrity. Jamie Lee Curtis, the actress used to do commercials for this yogurt called Activia. And the companies claim that it improved your digestion turned out to be false. But here a celebrity, probably unknowing that it was a false statement, but nonetheless a celebrity and the company together, they hijacked a lot of people’s perceptual intelligence who just blindly believed the ads and ran out and bought this yogurt, expecting to help them with a digestive problem, when in fact, it was shown by the end the FTC came down on the company for false claims. So when people least let now they understand the influence of celebrities and how that can seduce people to believing what they want to believe. Having that insight can help people become more bulletproof against that influence and at least to to check it out and be critical about the think critically about what they hear. And there was an interesting situation too, because so many people believe what they read on the internet now. And there’s a comedy website called The Onion. And they put out a joke press release, a complete joke, fake press release, stating that Johnson & Johnson, the makers of visine, have now come out with eye whitening strips.

Kim Sutton No, they didn’t. They really?

Brian Boxer Wachler Well. There’s a lot of people who have bloodshot eyes or sun damaged eyes, brown spots on the eyes, as well are yellow spots. Well, because I had developed an actual eye whitening surgery to help people like this. We had all these people starting to call– well, first, they were calling Johnson & Johnson asking about the strips. And they said, well, they don’t exist. Well, a lot of people started calling my office and asking my staff andwe said “No, no. They don’t exist. This was a joke.” But then some people asked the staff, they actually asked the staff, “Well, can I go out and buy the Crest teeth whitening strips, and just put those in my eyes.” And they said, “Yes, 100% true.” And my staff said, “No, no, that’s dangerous. Don’t do that.” But this makes the point though, this is what– this is really the point of the story, is when people have emotions behind a problem they want to solve, a lot of times will grasp at straws, right. And sometimes it can be dangerous straws that they grasp out. And when you have an emotional aspect to where you’re going with the belief, understand recognize that you’ve got an emotional component. And that takes some discipline, that’s not always easy, especially in the heat of the moment, to then take that pause and evaluate and think critically, is this really true? Maybe I should research this a little more before wanting to do something like that? Because you’ve got the emotion there. And like I said, it’s not always easy and it takes some real self discipline sometimes but it can really save people from getting into some serious problems. Yeah, I mean, including financially, I mean, you look at Madoff people who really wanted to make money by investing with him.

Kim Sutton Oh, absolutely.

Brian Boxer Wachler And a lot of people really lost a lot of money, including their savings, retirees, you know, all their savings gone because of Bernie Madoff with that whole Ponzi scheme. So you know, this applies to everything in life, especially when you have emotions that are driving the direction you’re going down.

Kim Sutton Well, as an entrepreneur, I can say that I’ve seen that a lot too, just by watching the “gurus” or the people who seem to be having great success in the entrepreneurial communities that I’m in. You know, I’ve thought, well, just because they’re using this product that means that that’s going to work for me. I suffered from shiny object syndrome. For the longest time, I can’t even tell you how much money I spent on products that didn’t work for me, just because I actually wasn’t even prepared to use them. But they won’t say that, you know, they want the affiliate commission. So they’re like, yes, get the tool that helped me reach this high level of success. But they forgot to mention, but it took me five years of hard, hard, hard work to get here. You can’t just sign up for the tool and have it happened.

Brian Boxer Wachler Right. They’re dovetailing in leveraging people’s inner desires to have a shortcut. And that’s when people with low perceptual intelligence that don’t quite understand, you know, can jump in. And I remember one time in college, I got completely duped as well. You know, I wanted to make some extra money, do some modeling. And there was this I grew up in Lausanne in Santa Monica and I was at UCLA in college, and I saw this ad in the paper, and I thought, great. You know, and so I went to this, like, “audition”, and then you had to pay and ones they sort of accepted you and they had this really bogus court, like, few sessions, where they taught people how to walk down the runway. And you know, and then afterwards, if you wanted to get to the next level of training, had to pay more, and, you know, and it was a total scam. And that was just began, I was like, you know, wanting to make some extra money in college and, you know, the “flattery” of being accepted into a program like that appeals to people’s egos. And it’s the same parameters, why people get taken advantage of all the time in a lot of other areas.

Kim Sutton Oh, yeah. I know I could get some haters off of this and that’s okay. But I’ve seen the same happen in MLM no look at the success that these top earners are getting, but what it’s requiring is that you invest money in that channel– that funnels up the ladder, and then you have to go and get money from other people. I mean, I’m not an advocate. Sorry listeners, to those of you who are in network marketing or MLM I know that I’m probably passing a bunch of you off, but I just really can’t support that because there needs to be total transparency. Early in 2017, I heard about an event that was I think in the Bahamas, I don’t remember exactly where but it was supposed to be. I should say hosted by a well known musician and somebody else. I don’t remember the names right now. I wasn’t really planning on bringing this up. But they were selling this weekend concert that was supposed to be luxury, everybody was going to be in luxury accommodations and given awesome food. But what the organizers had tried to do is basically build a city on this island in less than a year. And they had no electricity. By the time the event week happened, the tents weren’t set up. It was ragged cots that were on. They were on wood pallets, the food was being served in styrofoam boxes, and it was basically two pieces of bread a slice of cheese, like Velveeta cheese. Brian, not anything fancy in a slice, or in a piece of lettuce. So all these people had spent like, $5 to $10,000, to get down there just because it was promoted by this big name. And they got there, and they found nothing. And in the end, all these people were at the airport, just trying to get home because there was no electricity. There were no accommodations for them all.

Brian Boxer Wachler And then there was a sounds like a celebrity musician who is promoting this.

Kim Sutton There was. He admitted after the fact that he had made a mistake. His intention was good, but he didn’t realize how much time and effort and work it was actually going to take to make this happen, which I understand. I think, like, I know that as an entrepreneur myself, we can often get into having grand dreams and not really thinking about how much time it’s really going to take. I mean, I just gotta be real, I face it every single day. But I do feel bad because all these people, they didn’t just buy something, but they actually got themselves on a plane and flew out of the country to be at this event just because of who it was organised and endorsed by,

Brian Boxer Wachler That’s an example of the halo effect again, right? People admired this musician, he was promoting something not even not related to what his core business is that has gained him notoriety. And it turned out to really be a big misrepresentation. But that influence was there, clearly there.

Kim Sutton Right? I don’t mean to get overly political. But while you were in Russia, what was it that you were seeing that inspired you the most to write the book?

Brian Boxer Wachler You know, Putin really had presented himself to the world and the media largely had bought into this vision of himself that he created and manufactured, that he was this renaissance man, man of the world, doing all these really benevolent things. And as it a turned out under the surface, even to build the Olympics in Sochi, the Winter Olympics, which is essentially the climate of Northern Florida, where you’re going to now have the Winter Olympics, is almost trying to prove that he’s a demigod. And how they had to displace and move– many people who lived in Sochi, with the equivalent of eminent domain, but without any compensation was an example. There were human rights that were being protested about, you know, in the gay and lesbian community. And I can’t tell you how many people were thrown in jail because they didn’t want to have, you know, people making a scene when people came to the Olympics. There were hundreds, if not 1000s, of stray dogs that were killed, so that people wouldn’t have dogs around them when they were there, so a lot of really inhumane terrible things. And, of course, right after the Olympics, within probably about a week or so he was on this high PR, cloud wise, and then invades Ukraine. Because he was riding at such high, especially in Russia, you know, with this poll with very high polls, at that point. So, those are just a few of the things but, you know, at that point, then the world kind of got a little bit of a wake up call of like, again, a reminder of who he really is, and how perception [inaudible]

Kim Sutton Right. The world seems to be getting a lot of [inaudible]

Brian Boxer Wachler Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, it’s hard. I was just listening to Ted Koppel speak. He used to be the host of Nightline. And it’s interesting, you know, with news now is there was a FCC ordinance/ruling that got revoked under Reagan that had required all the major news networks to have balanced news. So if you had somebody from the left, you have to have somebody from the right and vice versa. Well, after that got removed, that’s when you stopped really having news organizations be fair and balanced and that’s what we’re seeing really now and a very extreme form of it. And somebody asked the question, Well, where do you get your news? And what do you advise what you understand what’s true and what’s not true. And he’s like, you have to watch both sides of the spectrum to see not just– if you’re watching CNN, because you want to, and you like what they’re saying, but you should also watch fox to hear what they’re saying too. Which I thought was really insightful, you know, to hear both sides, and then you can make a decision, and perhaps do some more research. But that’s why we don’t have fair and balanced news anymore.

Kim Sutton Yeah. For listeners who are outside of the United States, since the Trump Clinton election, what year was that, 2016. I mean, besides my husband and a couple other people I’ve never discussed who I voted for, and I’m still not going to share now. But I won’t even share what new station I watch, just because I don’t want to be judged in either direction.

Brian Boxer Wachler And you know, he said Ted Koppel. And for people outside the country may not who are listening may not know who he was. He’s still one of the most legendary newscasters of our era. He hosted a show Nightline for four decades, which was extremely highly regarded. And so he said, now, in 2018, there was a research study that was done, I believe, he said, from Harvard that showed people are more likely to have interracial marriages than they are to have inter political marriages.

Kim Sutton I can so see that, especially in the climate of the United States right now. And that’s actually one of the–

Brian Boxer Wachler Just as shows you–

Kim Sutton — that’s one of the reasons why I steer clear of social media, I just don’t even want to see those discussions going on anymore.

Brian Boxer Wachler Yeah. So in any case, even if you’re listening to the news, whether it’s we’re watching or reading or listening on the internet, you have to solve really well developed critical thinking skills and not just believe what you want to believe. But really try to always seek the truth. It’s very hard now in the news, because of the lack of requirements to be fair and balanced. But it’s important that that improves your perceptual intelligence, which is what it’s all about. So you can make better decisions and operate off of better, more truthful information in your life.

Kim Sutton Absolutely. How can we make better decisions? How can we make more insightful decisions in our life?

Brian Boxer Wachler When we understand that we have personal biases, which could range from a host of things, like we mentioned earlier. When you have that insight and awareness and you’re honest with yourself, then you can identify why you might be believing a certain thing. And that can help you defuse it so you can get to the truth about a matter. But on the other side of the spectrum of perceptual intelligence, we’ve kind of been talking a lot, Kim about the critical thinking part of perceptual intelligence. But on the other spectrum is the other side of it, which is the intuition and gut feeling aspect of perceptual intelligence, which is having confidence when you have an idea come to you, or you’re falling asleep at night, or you’re waking up, wake up another night or if you’re meditating, and just you have this idea about something, and a gut feeling about something, or you’re in a situation you have a gut feeling is lots of studies have actually shown, even though we don’t know where it’s coming from. We don’t know if it’s your subconscious that’s giving it to you. Or if it’s this infinite wisdom, higher intelligence that’s out there that’s giving, you know, we don’t know. But a lot of times, that’s going to lead you in the right direction. So a lot of times people may not be comfortable going with gut feelings on major decisions even. But it’s important to at least not discount them as a knee jerk reaction, but to evaluate it and and understand that there might be something there that you can benefit from and may help you in what you’re trying to achieve.

Kim Sutton I so appreciate you bringing that up. Because just recently, well, since I launched the podcast, I have actually switched my thinking from chasing income to pursuing impact. And I also, Brian I don’t know if you know this about me, sorry, listeners, I know you’ve heard about it so much. But I’m writing a book called Chronic Idea Disorder, because I have those ideas all the time. And I mean, all the time, shower driving, trying to get to sleep. But one of the things that I’ve started doing really is following my gut. And it’s been some have a challenge with my coaches, just because some of them know that what would be best. Well, maybe they don’t know. They think they know what would be best for me financially, but I’ve been resisting and I’ve been following my heart and my passion and my purpose more. And it’s actually been working out. So I love that you brought that up, because I can see how it’s working for me. It’s in my head for a reason and I need to follow it.

Brian Boxer Wachler Yeah. And you just talked about something so important, which I think some people get to in life, and some people never get to, which is, it’s not about your bank account. I mean, there’s so much around us socially, and culturally, that indicates it’s about the bank account. And of course, you need to be able to support yourself and your family. But when you really think about it, is that really why we’re here? Right? I mean, that’s a bit of an existential question. But I wrote an article for the Huffington Post last year, called what is the purpose of life? And I wanted to try to prove what the purpose was. And a lot of people believe it. And some people can have terrible experiences that lead them to believe that, you know, we need to do good for other people. And a lot of virtually all the religions have that, even the US Constitution is based upon a lot of those tenants of doing good and not doing bad things. But I wanted to try to prove that. And so in my article that was published in Huffington Post last year, I think I achieved being able to use the human body in any living thing, but I talked mostly about the human body, and what happens on a– we weren’t even aware of all the millions and billions of processes that occur at any given moment to keep us healthy inside, in any of our organs, in any of the tissues, in any cells into prevent harmful suffering related things that can happen and insults. And therefore, that’s how the extension of our behavior, you know, based, that’s in a nutshell. And so, that’s why, you know, I think we’re here to do good for other people, and to also help prevent pain and suffering and misery for other people at the same time. And when people have that understanding, and even something as simple, you know, I’ve gotten feedback of somebody, you know, for example, who’s gone through the article, and it causes a mind shift for them, that they look through everything in their life differently. And it’s not requiring somebody to change their job or what they do. But it’s just like in your business, for example, if you’re in a business, or you’re working, or you have your own company, or you’re interact with other people, like you look at everything from a, you know, it’s not just about trying to make as much money as I can at the expense of other people. It’s doing things in a way that’s going to still be beneficial. And even incorporating how you can use your company or if you’re working, or doing something over the weekends to still be able to help other people in the process. And I think that can be very profound when people realize that. That’s really why we’re here.

Kim Sutton Absolutely. Thank you for sharing all of that. I completely agree. I don’t know that I’ve ever shared this on the podcast. And I’m not going to designate which parent was which. But I saw both sides of the fence of the economic fence growing up, one parent thrived financially and the other one definitely didn’t. But I can tell you from personal experience, that the stress level wasn’t necessarily any different on either side. There was great stress on both sides and both parents experienced their own struggles. Both were constantly chasing, right, different avenues. And there were health implications for both. And it took a long time, just growing up like that to realize that neither side was necessarily right, and that I just needed to step back and see where I wanted to be. And when I finally realized that I needed to stop thinking, well, someday when I have, or someday when I get wasn’t the case that I actually am happy right now. And I am very grateful for everything that I have. So many shifts have, it was amazing.

Brian Boxer Wachler Especially you mentioned a very important word there, Kim, which is gratitude. When you have gratitude, you also enable yourself to be happy, because you’re oftentimes better than a lot of other people. And when you can understand that and appreciate that and have gratitude that allows you to also be happy too.

Kim Sutton Oh, absolutely. I am not saying this to toot my own horn, because I never want to– well, no, I really don’t ever want to toot my own horn. But one thing that gets underneath the skin of my boys and my boys are older than the rest of my three kids. They’re 12 and 15 will be driving somewhere, anywhere. And even in times of struggle we’ve seen people standing on the side of the road, you know, their sign that they’re homeless and they’re struggling and they need a little bit of money. And up ahead of us there may be four really nice cars and they all just drive right by but then there’s people who, and I’m not saying that none of those cars stop, please know that I’m generalizing. But then we’ve stopped. And we’ve given, I’ve even given the last $5, just because I know what it feels like. But I know that I have what I need and I wish that more of society was like that. We have what we need, and more will come but we just need to be grateful for what we do have and to share those blessings.

Brian Boxer Wachler That’s a really good point. And you talked about the homeless, which is something that’s kind of close to me, is for four years, once a week, when I’m on my way to working out or going to, I like to row here in the Marina, in Marina Del Rey in Los Angeles. I will stop in this area a nd I always have my trunk full of new socks. And I’ll give out anywhere from 20 to 40 pairs of socks, just walking around with the bags. And you know, I’m just doing it anonymously, nobody knows really who I am. And I’m known as the sock guy. And it’s just I’ve made that a routine, like a weekly ritual for me and my daughters are now also part of this, my twin daughters that are 11. And so they’re not there with me every week, but it’s part of me showing them about doing good to help other people too. And so that’s a very small thing, but makes a big difference for people when you can do that. And however anyone can do it, to help other people, even if it’s a small thing, even if it’s letting somebody in when you’re in traffic, right? And you’re on a busy street and bumper to bumper and somebody is trying to make that right turn from a side street, just let them in. Let them in.

Kim Sutton Absolutely. Is it gonna kill you to wait two seconds for them to pull out and go? No, just go. Yeah, I didn’t realize you were a twin parent as well, Brian.

Brian Boxer Wachler I am.

Kim Sutton Yeah. And you survived 11 years. You give me hope, mine are only three. [inaudible] both and oh my gosh, yes. And I have a four year old daughter and a three year old daughter. So you are just about to approach that age that I am so afraid of. That lovely age that they are hitting teenage years. My daughters are already divas. I fear that age. Which brings me into my next question. I wasn’t at all thinking that we would be approaching this. But this is how the positive productivity podcast goes. You and I live in very different areas. I’m outside of Dayton, Ohio, and a very rural blue collar area and you’re in LA, which is very different as far as raising children. I mean, my kids don’t see the same things that yours do. And I don’t mean to be generalizing, but I think it’s just true. Do you agree?

Brian Boxer Wachler 100% 100%.

Kim Sutton So how do we best support our children? Well, I am going to be more specific. How do you best support your children and bring them up in a way that helps them create their own identity, especially in such a, lucrative is not the right word that I’m looking for, maybe you can put it in a–

Brian Boxer Wachler Materialistic

Kim Sutton Materialistic. Yes, environment. Exactly.

Brian Boxer Wachler It’s something my wife and I’ve worked really hard at. We are both on the same page, parenting wise. And we know and I came from very modest background, my parents were hairstylists. My dad actually he’s 85 years old, he still cuts my hair. So to me, I’ve never really had a very, you know, strong men materialistic drive. I grew up very modestly. And, and that was fine with me. And especially now that I mean wanting to be a doctor, I wanted to help people. And to me, that’s really what it was about. So in raising our daughters, it’s really important that we lead by example, not by what we say necessarily, but by what we do. So that’s why we, for example, don’t have a lot of crazy luxurious things that a lot of their friends have in school, for example, because I don’t we don’t want to set that as an example for the kids. I drove like a fifth car for the same car that was like 15 years old or 12 years old until it finally you know, well, somebody rear ended me and had to get a new one. But, you know, just another example of just how we keep them grounded. And especially here, you know, there’s always the you know, can I have that, you know, someone saw at school has a phone? Well, our kids don’t have any electronics that they take to school, and we’re gonna hold out as long as we can. Especially with smartphones, because now lots of research has come to bear that social media for kids is really damaging. The rates of depression and suicide attempts have never been higher than now. And it’s because of social media. And this is really the reason why in a nutshell, if somebody gets left out of going to a party, and by the way, there’s a great article written in the Atlantic about how smartphones have damaged a generation, which cites a lot of this research. But if somebody, you know, pre social media gets left out of going to a party with some other friends, okay, they feel bad for like a day or so. And then they move on. But with social media, they’re always checking, they’re seeing what their friends are doing. Their friends are together, if they’re not part of that group at that time. Like they see it constantly. It’s in their face constantly. And it’s very addictive. I mean, even to the point that, you know, the CEO of Apple has come out and said that, you know, he won’t let his nephew use social media, electronics, and major institutional investors in Apple have said, apple, you need to do something, this is a problem for kids. It’s too addictive. And it’s very damaging. And these are investors, which are in this by saying this or saying, This is more important than profits, you know, selling more phones, like you need to do something to curb this use in in teenagers, essentially. So not allowing your kids in the middle school years especially, and younger to have phones and an unlimited Electronics is one thing that also that can be very helpful for raising kids in no matter what environment you’re in. They add whether it’s Dayton or Cincinnati, or, or Raleigh or Los Angeles, or anywhere else.

Kim Sutton I hadn’t really thought about that. Wow. And I can see, just in my boys, I can see how that would impact them.

Brian Boxer Wachler It’s so addictive. I mean, people can kids can spend hours on the weekends just laying on their bed, on their phone. And they don’t understand what damage is occurring. But the research is so clear. I mean, to the point you even like I said, have major people with these companies, including a former executive from Facebook saying, we knew something may have been bad coming from all this. But now we know.

Kim Sutton Well, I don’t mean to make a drastic shift like this. But just to lighten it up a little bit.

Brian Boxer Wachler I can tell you a joke.

Kim Sutton In the talking points that were sent to me, which are very helpful By the way, one of the talking points was why is it some people can’t resist cat poop coffee, even with the seat price of 100 a cup? Hey, I told you that drastic shift listeners you and I know you couldn’t have been prepared for that one. cat poop coffee.

Brian Boxer Wachler Yes, so so there’s this this is example of marketing, how it can hijack people’s perception and waste their money. So there’s a coffee that comes from Indonesia called Kopi Luwak. And that sounds pretty exotic, right? And the story is that in Indonesia, there are these special types of cats that can eat these beans, that coffee beans that fall on the ground, but they have this sort of magical ability to pick the very best beans and they eat them. But it goes through the cat and digested and comes out the back end. And somebody in Indonesia has the job of picking through the remains and getting those beans out and cleaning them. And that’s the story that goes into why people are paying $100 a cup for this coffee. Because the beans are apparently the very best beans because these cats have this ability to pick out the Primo beans off the off the ground. But the reality now is that the beans are good and it makes good coffee, but it’s not going to knock your socks off. But it’s how marketing when laced with a really good story can hijack your perceptual intelligence and waste your money.

Kim Sutton All I can think about is you know, eating a whole bunch of different colored jelly beans in farting rainbows. I’ve never said anything like this other positive productivity podcasts. I don’t think I’ve ever said something so inappropriate, but I just couldn’t think of anything else to say like, Wow, really imagine putting coffee into my system where I knew that that’s where the beans had come from. But I said, Brian and I had discussed this a little bit before the episode I was joking that, you know, maybe I can make money off of all these– I almost put a bad word in there. All these cats that we have in my house right now, but no, I am not about to start go sifting through cat poop to find the magical bean to come out the backside.

Brian Boxer Wachler Yep, yep. Yep, that’s marketing for you, right?

Kim Sutton Oh my goodness. Wow.

Brian Boxer Wachler So you have to be a critical thinker.

Kim Sutton Wow, Brian, I don’t even know where we can take this next. I definitely would love to continue this conversation though in another episode, because I believe there’s so much more that we can talk about. So yeah, I would love if you share where listeners can find your book so that they can become more perceptive or gain more pie right in their life.

Brian Boxer Wachler Well for better decision making the book Perceptional Intelligence is available now on Amazon, Barnes and Noble and essentially anywhere books are sold. And also Kim, we didn’t have a chance to talk about this but there is also in the book an amazing chapter on sex and our perceptions about that and what happens when you change your perceptions how that actually can improve your sex life. So do go get the book now.

Kim Sutton I am interested again. Oh my gosh, I feel so inappropriate in this episode.

Brian Boxer Wachler I guess I bring this out.

Kim Sutton Yes, absolutely. Brian where can listeners find you online and connect with you. In fact try to find their eye whitening strips?

Brian Boxer Wachler Well, our main website which is boxerwachler.com B-O-X-E-R-W-A-C-H-L-E-R dot calm, which talks about all the other procedures I do including our fortified LASIK, our eye whitening procedure etc. and dry eye treatments too. And then for keratoconus patients. The website is keratoconusinserts.com and you’ll find all the information about Steven Holcomb, the Olympic bobsledder and his story and there’s even a TEDx talk that I gave as well, that’s on the website too, talking about my story. And a lot of the struggles I had against the medical establishment to legitimize the procedure because I was fighting against the establishment that we’re really entrenched with doing cornea transplants, which this new procedure called now Holcombe C3-r had threatened because it was preventing people from getting transplants so that’s all on our keratoconus inserts website. And of course in the Olympics, I would encourage people to watch the bobsled because it’s now the first time that the team is moving forward without their leader, Steven Holcomb because he unfortunately had passed away this year tragically. So there’s bound to be media coverage about that too. And he’s so inspirational, because of what he overcame with his vision to achieve what he achieved, so just incredible inspirational person.

Kim Sutton And listeners if you are listening to this episode, on the release date, the opening ceremonies are actually tomorrow. And that’s February 9 of 2018. Just in case you are driving or at the gym and you weren’t able to write down the links that Dr. Brian provided you can get all the show notes at the kimsutton.com/pp280. Brian, this has been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for joining me. Do you have a parting piece of advice or a golden nugget that you can offer to listeners?

Brian Boxer Wachler I do and think about the big picture why you’re really here. And I don’t think it’s to have the bank account or any of the other materialistic things. I really think it’s here to do good to help people and to minimize pain and suffering for people. And think about how you can incorporate that in on a regular basis, in your job, in your life, and help other people that are in your life also understand that to.